AP Racing 6 Pot Calipers

[MyK24A]

I know that it fits on the CL-7 Euro R, any idea it'll fit on the CL-9?

[Noel]

Yes it will, the CL7/9 chassis is almost identical ... If they have a kit, you'd most likely need the following parts only ...

- Calipers
- Rotors
- Brake Lines
- Pads
- Correct offset rims
- Tyres

Not a cheap upgrade.

[Oxygene]

yep, not cheap, but possibally the best.

[Noel]

Honestly, I wouldn't say it's the best especially measured on the "bang-for-your-buck". It's simply another choice of what's available, that's all.

[MyK24A]

Think its an overkill for street use, wat would u recommend Noel? I was thinking abt the Spoon Monoblocks

[Noel]

Indeed, the Spoon setup is quite ideal for road/track use because of many PROs in the design ... Even the Spoon setup is good enough for serious racing.

[MyK24A]

Will consider the monoblocks :) thanx man~

[Noel]

Feel free to ask if you need more information.

[Zasker1]

Just my Two Cents but I have a Bremo Package and the car seriouly stops when you hit the brakes, and they are a little cheaper.

[Arrow]

Just my Two Cents but I have a Bremo Package and the car seriouly stops when you hit the brakes, and they are a little cheaper.

Hi

can you show some links or info on this brembo kit ?


thanks

[Noel]

Those Brembo calipers in that series also weigh 200% heavier, cost 300% more than Spoon calipers ;)

[nachob]

I'm considering the Brembo but I'm concerned about brake bias. Will the rears be useless since there is so much up front but you're still limited by the tires. Also, is the master cylinder big enough so that you don't need Arnold Schwarzzeneggers right leg to stop?

Finally, where is the best deal to get a set?

Ignacio

[lunner]

Zasker1 how much you got your Brembos for? Got pics?

[Noel]

4 pot Brembos are fine, they will still retain the factory brake bias. The rears are never useless. What has brakes got to do with tyres? The master cylinder is fine for a 4 pot and the most a mini 6 pot system regardless of manufacturer.

The 6 pot APs are a serious overkill for a CL7/9. Especially when it doesn't even produce enough power to pack the need for such braking power.

Zasker would be using the "GT" series Brembos. You can find more information on the Brembo US official site.

[Cyde]

I've been reading alot of articles from well respected sources, and new reaserch has shown that with the new big brake kits coming out, they only address the front brakes, brake feel might be beter and and less fade and increase in overall performance, But braking distance is actually increased and handling while on brake is reduced.

don't blieve it, do the test your self, (by this we don't mean seat of your pant feeling, it is not a accurate form of measure, do some real measurments!) few people that install these kits, even lot of shops that install them don't know how to tune brakes properly, if you only upgrade the front you'll have premature lock up, and no mater how much you adjust the brake bais vavle you will not get optimal braking because the ratio is no longer the same and you cannot get optimal braking even from your new calipers let alon all-around.

If you upgrade your brakes, do it all around, and do it the rite way, because other people are using the roads, it's not place to fool around.

[SAZABI]

Bleh!!! really???

damn... I was planning on that... guess I will just forget about it.

[Noel]

Indeed, I always advocate not to believe everything you read. And understanding brake bias/distribution is not a general wide article or blanket knowledge across the board. In fact, every manufacturer right down to every model has a very different way of setting how the brakes work.

From factory, the brakes are designed to stop even with approximate 50%-75% power increase. However, that is not optimal and puts undue excessive wear. Thus people look at improving braking power whilst maintaining or improving wear and tear characteristics from whatever power increase.

My knowledge and experience is heavily based around Hondas only, I won't propagate useful change for 95% of the people because they haven't even found the limits in the factory setup. However from my experience over the past decade.

Hondas never or even almost never need a rear caliper or larger rear brake upgrade even with significant power upgrades. And per/say of overloading with massive calipers in the front without understanding the balance of the setup is indeed an overkill with little to no real benefits.

[SAZABI]

lol, i don't think i will have time to do a research...

so it is good to have the front upgraded on CL9?

[Noel]

Depends on what you want to do with the car, if you're going to drive it only on the road for the most part of the time. No, it's not necessary to upgrade any calipers. But if you're thinking about doing some trackwork, that'll be a good idea.

Improve pads, brake fluid, brake lines. These are the more essential things to concentrate on before touching the calipers or rotors.

[johnej]

what kind of pads would you recommend for a combined street/track use?

[Noel]

If you're more bias to use the pads for track, definitely Endless Type NA-R. This offers serious braking power as the temperatures build up, the hotter it gets, the better it brakes. However, the downside to this is ... When it's cold, it's not optimal in stopping and can be worse than factory standards because it's not in the correct operating temperature range.

If you're more bias to use the pads for road and perhaps one or two track days in the lifetime of the pads, I'd say Endless Type NA-S. This has a lower temperature working range and would ideally benefit even hard driving/braking daily when compared with the above application.

There are however downsides to running race compound - high temperature brake pads. First off, you'd notice a more significant level of brake dust generated, if you like to be clean ... This will upset you. And you also put more wear and tear to the rotors and also use more brake fluid when compared with factory standards in trade for better/stronger and more consistent stopping power when required.

[johnej]

Thank you sir for the information

[Cyde]

Noel has a point, It really depends on your aplication, If you are on the track then the caliper upgrade is not a bad idea becasue it gives you better consitency and won't fade, I find on the track the TSX brake are good to begen with they have very little fade thought out the day, but not as consitant towards the end. where as using the oem calipers on a daily spirited driving in and out of town is fine, maybe upgrade to some Hawk MPS compund pads are more than adequate for 227km/h rapid decelecations to 0km/h.

I find the OEM calipers with Hawk carbon ceramic pads all around, upgraded brake lines all around, brake fluid, and ....maybe some slotted (but not cross drilled cuz they warp) rotors will be more than adequate for the most spirited of drives if you know what i mean lol.

Lot of the big brake kit put on cars out ther are more bling than purpose.
I don't believe everything i read, but when several well acredited and respected sources say the same thing, and the TV auto mags say the same thing.. you tend to start thinking and do your own test.

[StopTech]

what kind of pads would you recommend for a combined street/track use?
Is it too late to chime into this party?

There honestly isn't a pad that is great at track and street use. We suggest getting a set of pads for street use and switching out the pads for when ever you would go to the track. It's just like how you would switch to R compound tires when going out to the track.

[Joker]

Is it too late to chime into this party?
It's never too late :D

Thank you very much for your input StopTech :thumbsup:

[pcdawg]

bump!!

Sorry for bringing this thread back to life but was searching on brake upgrades and this came up and while reading through noel's advice its very interesting.

So its not use to upgrade just rotors and pads as you need to get better brake fluids and brake lines as well?

[Noel]

Rotors/braided lines and brake fluid do little to minimal on road use while pads will almost be the greatest contributor for stopping power. However, this isn't optimum and will be fine for street use only. As street requires minimal hard braking and have plenty of time for the pads and rotors to cool down, it has plenty of recovery time vs. track/competition work where everything needs to perform at optimum level. Hence the complete upgrade inclusive of all relevant braking components.

[pcdawg]

So ideally just by upgrading on a good set of pads will be more than efficient for street use only then?

Normally people dont overheat the oem rotors since they dont get too much work in heating up where they need to cool down faster?

What im looking for is a bit more stopping power than oem. Right now Im using stock rotors and have hawk hps pads. They are a good improvement as they do stop the car very well with no fading. So theres no need to get the most expensive rotors out there or even x-drilled and slotted rotors?

I plan on getting rotora slotted once my oems are due for a change or next year in april.

[Noel]

Yes, a good set of pads will be more than efficient for street use. OEM rotors are more than sufficient for trackwork with the correct pads. The improvement of slotted/vented rotors is the ability to dissipate heat faster and bite harder with the directional grooves.

However, they will sacrifice pad life. There isn't really an all rounded solution. For a street driven car, pads are relevantly enough. You won't need the rotors, fluid, braided lines, calipers work. And cross drilled aren't for performance improvement, never buy cross drilled.

[VorteC]

Through many years of mountain biking I've learned a thing or two. Hydraulic disc brakes on a bike are very similar to the disc brakes on automobiles. I've learned that the most important thing on a braking system is the pads.. the next is the way the hydraulic fluid is used to make the caliper bite onto the rotors.. lastly it would be fluid/braided lines/rotors.

[pcdawg]

Nice for the info guys! At least it saves me money in not getting the works.

For now i'll use the same set-up til the spring where I will replace the rotors with rotoras. With the oems, they rust like mad.

[ians]

But it is always good to flash the brake fluid more often then factory recommended. So I am planning to flash my brake fluid when I replacing my rotors & pads and my car is approaching 50k km now and my rotor already wrapped.