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Old 10-29-2012, 04:13 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Thumbs up FLP Compliance Bearings Install and Impressions

Full article here:
HTSpec TSX gets new Fastline Performance Compliance Bearings by PCI - HeelToe Automotive


Order Here:
Fastline Performance Compliance Bearings by PCI, 04-08 Acura TSX


Quote:
Originally Posted by mrheeltoe
The compliance bushings in later model Acura and Honda vehicles were part of an innovative design to handle suspension movement. Despite being unconventional, the system worked well at softening road inputs while effectively keeping the control arm attached to the car. Unfortunately the compliance bushings wear prematurely and crack, causing sloppy handling and excess vibration. The issue plagues TSX and TL divers alike, with many TL drivers reporting failures within 60,000 miles.



Pro Car Innovations has an awesome solution for replacing these bushings with a more durable spherical bearing. The bearing is a rigid mounting point rather than a flexy rubber one, which has the promise not only of longer life, but also of greatly enhanced road feel. Fastline Performance was quick to adopt this part as one of their own, recognizing the great benefit for performance and longevity that is so direly needed, especially on the 04-08 TL chassis.



Full article here:
HTSpec TSX gets new Fastline Performance Compliance Bearings by PCI - HeelToe Automotive
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Last edited by Mayuga; 10-29-2012 at 04:49 PM..
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Old 10-29-2012, 04:36 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Just placed my order, cant wait
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Old 11-08-2012, 11:03 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Looks interesting, and I would be considering to get a set if I wasn't a bit concern about installation.
Marcus, care to elaborate a little on that hand-press you used, and where I can find one? Also, I'm wondering what tools I could use for the rear bearing (I believe you chose not to install these). Is this something that's better left for a shop with proper tools?
Also how often would you suggest lubricating something like this? I'm a little concerned with sand/grit getting inside. And with the corrosion concerns that you've identified, is this really a permanent fix?
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Old 11-08-2012, 06:03 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The tool costs about $150. I had considered renting mine out for people to use...the other bearing you need a press with the right size press-tool. A shop could certainly do it.

Lubrication? I would say tossing some grease in there with your oil changes is probably good. Sand and grit cannot get inside the bearing race. The dirt/corrosion concerns I believe are based on sound theory but won't end up being validated in real life.
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Old 12-30-2012, 04:00 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Any impressions?
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Old 01-08-2013, 02:36 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I've given mine...who else has them? We have sold plenty!
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I highly recommend this mod, I had mine installed about a week ago
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Old 04-28-2013, 10:58 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I had the PCI bearings installed and so far I can say the steering is seemingly more responsive especially when turning, although I also had innovative 75a engine mounts installed at the same time and not sure if it can be attributed to these. I'll try to post a longer term review later.
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:08 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Canada

It would be good to hear from folks who had these for a bit now and perhaps over a winter. How are these holding up? Any rust? Any extra noises that start showing?

Also, Marcus, any recommendation on the need to add static toe out to compensate for missing rubber flex that helped with the turn in?

It seems the S2K version from Hardrace put some rubber sleeves for extra protection, which I think would make these perfect for those of us who live on snowy/salty roads:
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Old 04-30-2013, 11:22 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Old 04-30-2013, 01:32 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Found these VERY interesting articles with some input from our friend Marcus in 2009 and feedback from his friend at Honda design team in Torrance CA. Essentially in 2009 the school of thought was NOT to introduce hard spherical bearing types of bushings and that school of though changed in 2012 for some reason.

Thoughts in favour of possible damage to suspension parts from hard spherical bushings and thoughts on fixing the stock bushings with some 3M Windo-weld:
********* Community - View Single Post - '04 to '08 front lower control arm bushing failure - please read and look

A good paragraph from Honda info of Integra Type R suspension:
Quote:
"In order to enhance stability while braking in a straight line or cornering, the L-shaped lower control arm has been equipped with specially tuned compliance bushings. These bushings allow the lower control arm to impart a toe-out condition on the front wheels. Allowing the wheels to toe out while braking in a corner enhances stability and allows the vehicle to track more precisely."
Source: 1998 Acura Integra Type R -- Chassis - Honda.com

And some awesome links on how to beef up your engine mounts so they don't rip with the same approach possible applying to the compliance bushings:
Homemade Motor Mounts
How to Make Fill Your Engine Mounts With Window Weld - Solid Mounts

Then in 2012 our school of thought changes to go for the hard bushings:
********* Community - View Single Post - '04 to '08 front lower control arm bushing failure - please read and look

These are not Honda specific but found that this can be found as upgrades for Bimmers as well.

The points I tend to agree with:
- stock bushing allow the extra toe out under lateral cornering stress which helps the car to turn
- spherical bushings will cause extra harshness be forced and transmitted onto other components causing extra stress which can lead to who knows what over time not excluding premature wear of the remaining control arm bushings.

Perhaps this is why BOTH the compliance and 2nd lower bushing should be changed at the same time if one was to go this route, but then if folks drive on horrible pothole riddled roads - the hard frontal hits of the car flying into the pothole ridge will be taken by the subframe of the car - and possibly more by the tire causing more punctures. We in Canada get sharp edged potholes popping up EVERY spring once the snow goes, so while dodging them can be a sport, there is always that one that can get you.

So I'd love to hear some thoughts from Marcus and perhaps his friend at Honda design on the toe out and the change of heart on harsh impacts as well as from anyone with suspension engineering background. I guess these spherical bushings could work well on a track-only car that has static toe-out set for each specific track - and doesn't care much about straight line highway cruising stability - and can control the twitchiness through smooth skill and control of an experience track/race driver and never sees potholes. Example would be a fantastic super smooth and super sticky asphalt of Calabogie race track.
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Old 04-30-2013, 01:41 PM   #12 (permalink)
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That window weld has been done time and again on all makes/models...

Energy suspension or someone makes those inserts for the stock bushings to fill the voids (holes) in the bushings. I don't think there are ones specific to the CL9 though
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