TL Type S Brembos on a TSX - Page 5 - Acura TSX Forum
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post #61 of 280 (permalink) Old 02-20-2012, 08:44 PM
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I tried mounting the TL-S caliper lower then higher to the original mounting points. The tabs on the oem knuckle and the tabs on the Brembos are do fat that the caliper looks awful in those mounting positions. Also the oem wheels will not clear the Brembos unless they are spaced out.

So for now the choices are:
1) TL knuckle with wheel spacer for oem wheels. (No thanx too much work for a brake upgrade)
2) TL knuckle + TL or other wheels
3) Find the right rotor that will work + Spacer to clear the wheels or other wheels (Much better in my opinion)

Replacing a knuckle is too much work and money for a brake upgrade. I really want to stay away from it. I need to get a hold of a TL knuckle! I have a TSX knuckle in the garage ready to measure off against it.

So here is something that I am hoping I can get some help on from members here. I need to get a hold of a 03-06 Evo rotor. Someone in here must know where to borrow one for some measurements. Friends? I already hit my friend up but it could be a while for him to be free. Somewhere online this info might exist?
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post #62 of 280 (permalink) Old 02-20-2012, 10:06 PM
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Thanks for the efforts Bardi!

Here's details on the Evo rotor: I think the offset it too much (and too thick and possibly too large diameter: )

http://brakeperformance.com/images/d...lain/46064.gif

I think what we need is something about 310-312mm diam, 40mm offset, 25mm thick.

The S2000 rotor + stock knuckle (redrilled) satisfies most of that except for outer rotor diameter (10mm shy) but drilling knuckles is kludgy. Would be easier to install M12x1.25 timeserts into Brembo calipers and use stock bolts.

http://brakeperformance.com/images/d...lain/46064.gif

The closest thing I found at the above site after perusing a lot of rotors was something for a chevy cobalt SS (with brembos), it had the wrong bolt pattern I think but the other dimensions were close(r).

as much as I hate the idea the TL knuckle plus other wheels might be the easiest way. That, or TSX knuckle drilled out for larger bolts + S2000 rotor + other wheels.

Personally I don't care much for the OEM wheels anyway so was planning on replacing with something lighter like Koseis or similar (presuming they'd fit with these calipers).

As insane as it sounds I was thinking of keeping two sets of knuckles with brakes and everything, and swapping the whole knee seasonally. I just bought a nice set of 16" alloys and blizzaks and it would chap my ass if I had to get rid of those since they wouldn't fit the brembos. So, my idea was get TL knuckles, with brembos and 17"s that fit and run those in the summer, then swap on stock knuckles and brakes and 16"s in the winter. Yeah, I said it was insane... (though there are dry-break fittings made that can be used for hydraulic brake lines, so calipers could be swapped without having to bleed them each time... of course still would need to do the axle nut, tie rod (and maybe alignment, which I can do myself), upper and lower balljoint nuts, etc....)

-Ed

BTW, has anyone weighed the stock caliper? I think the brembos might be lighter, even though they are huge.
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post #63 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-15-2012, 10:23 PM
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Got a new TL knuckle in. The 04-08 TL knuckles that will work for the Brembo swap are the 07-08 TLS (both MT and Auto), and 04-08 MT only.

Here is the difference in the tie rod size. The TL is 2 mm bigger.

Top side is the same. So is the lower ball joints.

The OD along the uprights are the same.

Here is the big difference. The shape of the upright is designed straighter on the TL. This is because the TL's have lower offset wheels. I dont know if this will make the oem TSX wheels not fit yet. I will have to see. The angle of the top ball joint is angled better for lowered cars with the TL upright. The TSX one almost curves back in.


I measured and measured the spindles on both cars. They are identical. I was hoping I could just swap spindles instead on knuckles before. The only difference I found is the tabs on the TL knuckle. They are pushed back 4mm. This is the only difference from the brakes perspective. All someone needs is to space out the TL's rotors 4mm for everything to work with TSX knuckles. The back of the rotor is great for this.

Instead of buying another knuckle I am thinking of getting some laser cut spacers to make the brakes work. The aluminum ones you see on ebay I would not use. AL has a different thermal expansion than the rotor and spindle that it will be sandwiched between. I am certain it will cause stress cracks down the road. I am thinking of making the spacers out of sheet SS that is precision ground.
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post #64 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-16-2012, 02:15 PM
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I bought a pair of TL knuckles, it seems like the easiest way to go. I was planning on new wheels anyway so if they dont work with stock tsx 17s , I can live with that.

I wonder if a 1-2mm(?) sleeve can be made to allow not having to change the tierod end...? Probably not, but That would save some hassle if so.

Re 4mm spacers... Good thought. Need to have longer wheel studs too though, I'd think.... Also track will be 8mm wider in front too...

Can studs be removed without removing the hub with a press? On some of my older hondas the hub has to pressed out (read: new bearing) to replace wheel studs.

Thanks for ithe updates!

Ed
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post #65 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-18-2012, 07:43 PM
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I think the TL-S knuckles and tie rod ends should be used. Way easier.

Last edited by Brock; 06-17-2012 at 01:19 AM.
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post #66 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 11:41 AM
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Good thoughts. What is the difference (if any) btw 2nd gen TSX tie rod ends and TL-S tie rod ends?

Thanks,
-Ed
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post #67 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 12:52 PM
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Good to know about the tire rods. I will order a set asap.

Ed- maybe we should have a brembo install day .

The studs can be removed without removing the spindle. I usualy hit them with a hammer and they fall out. To put them back in I use an old nut long nut I have laying around. This helps pull the stud in place as the nut tightens against the spindle.
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post #68 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 02:08 PM
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Great info & pics....

Swapping newer Mustang spindles into older 80-93 Mustangs to accomodate newere & larger factory brakes is common.

But, there are some very subtle differences in some of the spindles & while some will bolt in, they will screw up the Mustangs front end geometry.

The subtle differences have to do with tie rod attachment location, spindle inclination, ackermann, etc...
These differences can cause some bumpsteer & handling issues.
Some of these differences can cause the castor to not be able to set within specs.

I suggest that Awoc take some very careful measurements & comparisons between the TSX & TL-S spindles.
I may be overthinking this but this would be very valuable comparison info.

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post #69 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 02:21 PM
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bardi - good to know about the lug studs. On some older hondas that's not easily done as the hub gets in the way of removing the stud from the backside. yeah, we should do a brembo day. ;-) I still need to clean up and beadblast/repaint the knuckles I have and order a few other bits like the hardlines for the brembos, pads and rotors and tierod ends, etc.

-Ed
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post #70 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 08:27 PM
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Tie rod end comparison.

Update: 2nd gen TSX tie rod ends won't work. Use the TL-S tie rod ends.


Last edited by Brock; 06-17-2012 at 01:20 AM.
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post #71 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 08:32 PM
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Brock, you are the man. That pic is exatly what I am looking for. The second gen TSX look like the exact thing that I need.

Galaxy-- By spindle I mean the part where the axle goes in. Dont confuse this with the upright or knuckle.
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post #72 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-19-2012, 08:47 PM
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The spindle/knuckle is one and the same on the Mustang.

Quote:
Brock, you are the man. That pic is exatly what I am looking for. The second gen TSX look like the exact thing that I need.


Quote:
Galaxy-- By spindle I mean the part where the axle goes in. Dont confuse this with the upright or knuckle.
When Bardi says "spindle", he may be referring to the hub.
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post #73 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-20-2012, 08:49 AM
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Agreed, Bardi is referring to the hub, IMNSHO. ;-)

Brock, thanks for the pics! those help a lot. Too bad none of those look like they are made of aluminum. :-/ That 2nd gen TSX one should work out great, I'll get those too probably. How much more are 3G TL-s ones?

I wish we could use some of the aluminum control arm parts out there like those from the RL or DC5 JDM.

-Ed
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post #74 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-22-2012, 10:31 PM
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so, correct me if I'm wrong. but it looks like this can be achieved by using the entire tl knuckle (with spindle), with tl wheels and 2nd gen TSX tie rod ends. but you guys are looking to create a spacer/bracket combo that will clear the stockers and not require a tl knuckle assembly?
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post #75 of 280 (permalink) Old 04-22-2012, 11:30 PM
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Very cool guys, will continue to follow.
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