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Has anyone driven both 5speed and 6speed manual tsxs? Is there any noticable diffrence in performance between the two?
6speed manual vs 5speed sportshift
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elaborate pleaseEuro.R said:
Well, for me the auto felt sluggish on the highway, especially the jump from 40-60 or 50-80 even when using the sportshift to go down to 2nd or 3rd. Also, manual trannys typically don't have as much parasitic loss as autos do when measuring horsepower to the wheels (whp). I also believe the gear ratios are different (more agressive) on the manual which summarizes the differences in gas mileage between the manual and auto. The auto actually gets better gas mileage.
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I can't comprehend what is the purpose of discussing something that needs to be physically experienced to determine what one likes. It's like saying what I like to eat but you might find it completely disgusting.
I could go on all day advocating why MTs are the only type of cars to buy over ATs but it's pointless ... It's my opinion, not anyone's else.
And if anyone needs to make a purchase decision of transmission based on other people's battling opinion from 2 sides, they clearly haven't experienced the car enough to understand what it's all about in the first place.
It's confusing enough to understand what so special about a particular make and model when trying to make a purchase. I don't think it's relevant and if anything practical to add more confusion into the mix of what everyone has their say on why they bought that particular transmission type.
But of course, that's entirely how I intepreted this particular subject. Thus my recommendation stated above. Until you drive it, you won't know which one you want.
I could go on all day advocating why MTs are the only type of cars to buy over ATs but it's pointless ... It's my opinion, not anyone's else.
And if anyone needs to make a purchase decision of transmission based on other people's battling opinion from 2 sides, they clearly haven't experienced the car enough to understand what it's all about in the first place.
It's confusing enough to understand what so special about a particular make and model when trying to make a purchase. I don't think it's relevant and if anything practical to add more confusion into the mix of what everyone has their say on why they bought that particular transmission type.
But of course, that's entirely how I intepreted this particular subject. Thus my recommendation stated above. Until you drive it, you won't know which one you want.
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Interesting.....and I think I have some interesting answers. And I bet other people would too.Noel said:
It's not really very similar to the "food" analogy, but even if it were: When you're in a restaurant, don't you sometimes/often ask the waiter for an opinion about the offerings, even though you can't "really" know without tasting them? Actually, when it comes to that example, I feel a little like what you said about the transmissions; usually I can't understand why people are asking the waiter what he thinks (because it depends what you like, and it's so subjective), but for better or worse, an awful lot of people DO like to ask the waiter about stuff like that. And sometimes I find it useful to do so, although I feel a little silly doing it because most of the time I'm telling everybody else how dumb it is. I don't know, maybe they just enjoy conversing about it.
And stuff like transmissions, yes indeed you have to experience it to "really" know. But it's much more objectively describable than food, isn't it? (Yes, it is.) And anyway, what if we just ENJOY conversing about it, as in fact we do? Isn't that enough in itself? Plus it's interesting to try to put it into words, and interesting to see how others do it, and how it compares with how we'd do it.
Anyway, I'll tell you this: When I first heard of the TSX (before it came out) and I wanted to get a feel for the car, I was able to get a truly vivid impression of it from how people described it in their posts. And that included the transmission, as well as everything else. I guess a lot of it came from the specs, plus info and impressions from Justin (most importantly from that, I think), plus I guess things that people had heard about the Euro Accord. It all added up to an extremely vivid impression. I wasn't sure at the time whether this impression was accurate, or whether it would correspond to my own actual experience of the car, but as it turned out, it WAS accurate, and it DID totally correspond. I'll never forget my first test drive: I was instantly dumbfounded, not just about how much I liked the car but about how much the experience coincided with the impressions I had gotten from people's posts.
Maybe people like Noel, who are more knowledgeable and who have standards and judgments that are more acute, aren't able to get much out of other people's verbal descriptions. But I certainly can, and I think most people can. And even if we didn't, wouldn't it be enough that we just ENJOY writing about it and reading about it?
I promise you, Noel, even if you personally can't comprehend how it could be useful, many people indeed do find it useful and of interest -- although indeed you're totally right that ultimately someone can't know what to decide without trying it himself.
Just my 0.03.
With respect to actual performance in terms of acceleration, people w/ auto TSXs have mentioned that they've ran 16.9-17.1 in the qtr mile. The 6 speed, OTOH, has been tested to run in the mid to high 15s. I have also read 0-60 times for the auto are in the 9 sec range vs. 7 sec for manual. So, yes, there is a significant performance penalty in choosing auto.
This is not surprising as most auto cars w/ low torque seem to lose a significant amt of performance when compared to their manual counterpart. Contrast this with high torque cars like the corvette and other american V8 cars where the automatics typically have very similar performance to the manuals. Automatic turbocharged cars also seem to have similar or even better acceleration than manual equipped versions.
This is not surprising as most auto cars w/ low torque seem to lose a significant amt of performance when compared to their manual counterpart. Contrast this with high torque cars like the corvette and other american V8 cars where the automatics typically have very similar performance to the manuals. Automatic turbocharged cars also seem to have similar or even better acceleration than manual equipped versions.
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Surely there is a compromise in performance with the 5AT, but I'd bet my bippy it's not anywhere near that much.
AFAIK we haven't seen any reliable figures yet (oddly enough) on 0-60 for the 5AT.
I've been threatening to go to the track and I still plan to. (What's keeping me from it is there's no track near here. And y'all know of course how busy I am.)
When you have several numbers from reputable sources, you can at least get some reliable indication. But (again AFAIK) we don't have that for the 5AT. And remember also that we've seen some ridiculously high figures for the MT, even up to the high 8's.
Based on my semi-scientific personal experience (i.e. doing some runs, although not precisely), I think 8.0 would be a very reasonable expectation with the AT, and I would really expect to do a little better. But I know there's no proof without the pudding.
But I know it ain't as bad as 9.0.....
AFAIK we haven't seen any reliable figures yet (oddly enough) on 0-60 for the 5AT.
I've been threatening to go to the track and I still plan to. (What's keeping me from it is there's no track near here. And y'all know of course how busy I am.)
When you have several numbers from reputable sources, you can at least get some reliable indication. But (again AFAIK) we don't have that for the 5AT. And remember also that we've seen some ridiculously high figures for the MT, even up to the high 8's.
Based on my semi-scientific personal experience (i.e. doing some runs, although not precisely), I think 8.0 would be a very reasonable expectation with the AT, and I would really expect to do a little better. But I know there's no proof without the pudding.
But I know it ain't as bad as 9.0.....
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I've driven both, and the auto seems just a bit sluggish than the 6-spd. Of course, you're talking about cherry cars that barely have 10 miles on the odo, but that's the first albeit quick impression that I got.
In my opinion, the TSX 6-spd is one of the best in the sports sedan market - very precise, and while the throws are not sports car-short, they're not terribly long either. Compared to the vague-feeling G35 stick, the TSX gives you a bigger sense of satisfaction snicking into the gears.
That's my impression - I know your original question was asking about performance - and I think the best answer to that is either look up some documented data on numbers and/or test drive both yourself for a seat-of-the-pants experience. But from a purely subjective angle - I can tell you that most people would find the 6-spd very satisfying to row through . . .
In my opinion, the TSX 6-spd is one of the best in the sports sedan market - very precise, and while the throws are not sports car-short, they're not terribly long either. Compared to the vague-feeling G35 stick, the TSX gives you a bigger sense of satisfaction snicking into the gears.
That's my impression - I know your original question was asking about performance - and I think the best answer to that is either look up some documented data on numbers and/or test drive both yourself for a seat-of-the-pants experience. But from a purely subjective angle - I can tell you that most people would find the 6-spd very satisfying to row through . . .
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