Acura TSX Forum banner

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
On 2004 AT:
Comptech Rear-Sway $105 plus $75 install = $180
Comptech Icebox intake: $150 + $80 install = $230
Acura A-Spec susp $600 + $200 install = $800
~$1,200.

OK, I've only kept cars completely stock prior to right now, but I'm kinda pumped to do some minor mods. Just want to get some feedback before jumping into. Thanks much to all who contribute to this informative forum.

Goals are to keep the car as subtle as possible while increasing my own fun to drive factor. I just don't think that the CAI will be the right choice for me, which is why the Icebox is on the list. The description of the Mugen intake is right up my alley (subdued snarl at WOT and supposed gains throughout power range) but cost is out of line. And with an AT, I don't want to risk any loss of torque at highway cruising speeds (2000-2,500 rpm) that seem to be there with CAI.

I know the Icebox will provide less gain, but I'm also hoping to not lose anything anywhere across the rpm range.

The rear sway has an almost universal thumbs up around here as a most pleasantly surprising low-cost mod, so it sounds good enough for me.

The A-spec Acura suspension seems good for me since I'm only interested in some handling improvements but not at the expense of daily drivability.

Rims/Tires might come in the future, but with decent treadlife left and since I'm not at all sure as to which rims I would get, I'm opting to put that search off for now and proceed as above.

Any & all (somewhat helpful) advice appreciated. Thanks!

edit: I can't type or add...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
like ur line of thinking....i plan on doing the mods u listed aswell. Mods too extreme get annoying, going conservative can save u alot of stress down the road. I think u made excellent choices.
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
1,514 Posts
Looks good, but I have to question an installer who's going to charge $200 to install the struts/springs (pretty cheap) vs. $75 for the sway, which could be put on at the same time, and would add maybe 10 minutes to the job......
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
7,952 Posts
If u want to wait untill the summer, I could prob do the Icebox/ Rear Sway Install, Not touching the Aspec Suspension, dont have a spring compresser, my Springs Im attcually getting done too... :scratch: I dont kow about teh ICEbox, personally Im a big CAI fan, but ur car, and if u want Id be more then happy to help w/ that... where are u getting the Suspension Installed by the way..200$ is pritty cheap
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Henry at SpeedWorld in Baldwin gave me estimates over phone. Parts themselves from Acura of Escondido - ebay auctions but I'm tryin to consolidate to save shipping.
I think the install is a combo deal and I wouldn't be surprised if it jumps a bit when I get a written est or go there. But I know they've been there a while so I'm hopin that they do a good job, which is way more important than $50 bucks more or less.

Memphis - thanks for the offer. If this doesn't all get done sooner, might take you up on it. I'll confirm pricing and report back on what the plans turn out to be.

My concern with the CAI is actually 3-fold:
1. loss of any torque at lower rpm
2. sound cause I want to keep it minimal for the most part
3. more stock look for future trade-in/resale purposes and for any work done at Acura dealer (I know the Icebox is aftermarket as well, but just looks lot different than the box style intakes and I just feel there would be less of a problem with any warranty issues the closer it looks to original.) imho...
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
7,952 Posts
Well, the CAI thing, Acura Dosent give a S**t about a Intake, that they kinda dont care about, some of the other mods thell give u warrenty crap about, but not A CAI, I personally Dont feel this loss of power at low RPM's... Personally It was hard to peel out previous to the CAI, alot easier now, and I love that sound...totally replaced my horn, someone pisses me off, downshift as I pass them, WOT, thell get the idea :D

But hey, Comptech Icebox seems pritty cool, personally I like Comptech, Im using there springs, hopefully gonna install that this weekend spring break, but I might not get a chance, (weather, ect....only 8 days what a Jip)

So good luck w/ the mods, if u decide u want me to do the mods for u be more then happy to if not Cant wait to see them at the Meet this summer
 

·
Sleeperus-Maximus
Joined
·
164 Posts
Holy crap! 80 dollars for an intake install? LMAO!

Ill do it for 20!

Seriously, its about as easy as a mod install gets. Unless that shop charges 160 bucks an hour they are seriously ripping you off.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
2 questions which is maybe how I should have positioned this:

1. Based on what I described, are these particular mods decent choices? I haven't pulled trigger yet on anything. Still open to suggestions, though I feel like I could go round n round and don't want to get too caught up in things that don't fit me, in particular, in the long run.

2. While I've been told by many of you about how easy the intake is to diy, I am just being honest in that I really don't have the time or inclination. Time is at a premium and if I can get these things done all at once and be happy, know it is being done right, and just be treated fairly, then I'm happy. Course, don't want to get ripped off eaither or waste $$.

But posts before say it is cheap for the springs, yet expensive for the sway bar and intake.

You guys think overall it is a decent selection of first mods and a fair overall price on the install (knowing that I'm willing to pay a fair price for the convenience of having it done...)

thks for all the responses in any event!!!!!
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
1,514 Posts
LI_NY_1 said:
Goals are to keep the car as subtle as possible while increasing my own fun to drive factor.
All good choices with that goal in mind.

The A-Spec suspension will give you a nice increase in handling without much penalty in ride quality. Same for the rear sway. And the Comptech Icebox is definitely more subtle than a CAI or SRI, along with a decent gain.
 

·
Sleeperus-Maximus
Joined
·
164 Posts
If you want my honest opinion, better tires will be a more worth while mod then any of the above, in every respect.
They will allow you to stop, go and corner faster. And I don’t mean just a little bit. It’s amazing how much a difference a good set of tires will make. Ill bet money that a decent set of tires will allow you to take corners faster then upgrading the suspension AND sway-bar.
Also, keep in mind that the larger rear sway will enhance the cars ability to lift throttle over steer. This can be either a good or a bad thing, depending on what you are trying to do and how experienced you are as a driver. It’s not a bad buy if you really like to take your car near or to its limits. Especially if you auto-x or road race on a real track. If you want an every day driver that doesn’t have a likely chance that you could spin when you hit a curve too fast? Keep it stock.

If it were me, I would go for some Toyo Proxies T1-S tires, in the widest width you can properly fit. The same size at all four corners. Forget the rear sway and intake for now. Instead, upgrade the suspension (if Tien makes a kit for your car, try their entry level coilover kit instead) with decent coilovers and of course get those tires on there. The Toyo Proxies T1-S is the best tire I’ve ever driven on. And I’ve gone through a LOT of tires. In the rain, there is no traction compromise. The sheer confidence it gives you when going through puddles of standing water is unsurpassed by anything but water specific treads. Hitting a VERY large puddle of standing water on the freeway at bear 80MPH, my car plowed straight through. I braced and held the wheel for that "jerk" you usually feel when you hit large puddles at speed. But it never came. I got off the gas and I barely noticed a reduction in speed. In the dry though these things really shine. None better this side of an R compound tire. Limit adhesion is astounding, and it progressively breaks loose so it’s very forgiving. Ice and snow are out of the question though.
There isn’t very much tire noise and the ride was much better then my previous set of tires. Paradas I believe. I paid 150 each for a set of 205-45-16s and it was worth every penny. Especially since they lasted me almost 2 years of hard driving and the odd auto-x run.

An intake by it self isn’t going to do too much for you. It will bump up the power a bit, but in reality it’s not going to be enough for you to really "feel". A rule of thumb is that you only feel a difference in the "ass-dyno" after you gain 10hp or more. Anything else is a placebo effect, or someone equating louder to faster.
The intake will make the engine sound very mean at WOT, which is pretty much its highest selling point at this stage in the game.
Do things is stages. Start with the suspension and tires. Later do an intake/header/exhaust. After that work in msc. Crap like the ECU, bushings, brakes and what not.

Oh and here is a bonus. If you also upgrade your rims to something lightweight, you can really help your self out. Check this out. My stock rims weighed approx 25lbs each. That’s pretty heavy for 15" rims!
My new rims weigh in at 14lbs each. That’s a difference of 11lbs at each corner, or 44lbs total. I even went in for some forged lug nuts which saved me an additional pound making it a total of 45lbs less then stock. I also changed the type of tires I was buying of course. Even though the diameter went up from 15 to 16", the profile was much lower and the compound was very different then the Michelin bricks put on there by Honda. The weight difference being 4 lbs each! So... 4 x 4 = 16 + 45 = 61lbs.
So that’s a total of 61lbs saved so far...

...But that’s not all! This is UNSPRUNG weight. Unsprung weight is weight on a car that isn’t loaded on the suspension. E.g. the wheels, tires, brakes and what not. Now here's the kicker. Unsprung weight, due to the mystery that is physics, is equal to 1.5 pounds taken from any "sprung" weight. That means we now have 61lbs x 1.5 which = 91.5lbs.

So by changing my rims and tires... and buying some 50 dollar lug nuts, heh...
I managed to shave the equivalent of 91 and a half pounds off of my car.
Another rule of thumb is that for every 100lbs removed, that’s 1/10 of a second subtracted from your 1/4 mile ET... pretty much what you would see by adding an intake on an otherwise stock car. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
JoeB18R said:
... Also, keep in mind that the larger rear sway will enhance the cars ability to lift throttle over steer. This can be either a good or a bad thing, depending on what you are trying to do and how experienced you are as a driver.
Thanks much for the input. Can you explain the first part above?

Got me some more thinkin to do...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Also, being in snowy NY, are "ultra high perf. summer" tires like the Toyo T1s absolutely undriveable in the snow? Is it one of those things where it would be foolish to try to use them year round and would require 2nd set of rims & A/S or snow tires, or maybe just take it slow in the snow.
I know there will always be trade-offs between performance & utility (like A/S tires) but this is something I need to consider also livin in NY and using this as a daily driver all year round. I just don't know where the bar falls on the spectrum. thx.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
167 Posts
You will not be able to drive the TSX in winter with the Toyo T1-S, they will become soooo hard once the temp drops below 50 degrees they will be useless = stuck in 1" of snow.
Living in Michigan, I always purchase a set of snows and throw them on the stock rims, then buy a sweet set of summer rims/tires. BTW, I wouldn't bother with the Toyo T1-S tires, as they are being replaced with a better tire, the T1-R :)

As for the rear sway bar and lift-throttle oversteer, lift-throttle oversteer is when you enter a corner and lift off the gas, with a larger rear swaybar, the rear end will/can break loose and slide out on you. In autocross and some corners in roadracing, we will brake hard into a corner, turn the wheel, then lift off the gas...back end will begin to come around, then you dial in more gas when the rear has the front-end pointed where you wish to go. It's a fine balance but one that is great in the hands of a skilled driver. An unskilled driver will often panick and totally get off the gas or even worse hit the brakes which will cause the car to spin out all together. Moving up to a 22mm rear swaybar is still gonna give the TSX a slight understeer atitude, one which will be fine for a daily driver. My only concern is a 22mm rear swaybar put on a car where the driver has no clue what to do when the rear begins to slide....especially in a car that sees winter/icy conditions.
My 2 cents.
 

·
Sleeperus-Maximus
Joined
·
164 Posts
LI_NY_1 said:
Also, being in snowy NY, are "ultra high perf. summer" tires like the Toyo T1s absolutely undriveable in the snow? Is it one of those things where it would be foolish to try to use them year round and would require 2nd set of rims & A/S or snow tires, or maybe just take it slow in the snow.
I know there will always be trade-offs between performance & utility (like A/S tires) but this is something I need to consider also livin in NY and using this as a daily driver all year round. I just don't know where the bar falls on the spectrum. thx.
The Toyos are NOT for snow or ice. They wont get you anywhere in those conditions. Forgive me, Im used to it never snowing here in southern california. If you want the best non studed snow tire around, try the Blizzak. it is consistantly rated the best by every publication out there. You can pick a set of those up and some cheap "winter rims" for a decent price. Run those in the winter, and in spring/summer and in the fall before it snows get a nice set of lightweight rims and those toyos. and yes the toyo t1-s is being "replaced". that just means the T1-S is going to be that much cheaper so dealers can get rid of their stock and pick up the new one ;)

and the man above did a good job of explaining the lift throttle oversteer. sounds like something you might not want, especially in the snow.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
125 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
TodaSi said:
... Moving up to a 22mm rear swaybar is still gonna give the TSX a slight understeer atitude, one which will be fine for a daily driver. My only concern is a 22mm rear swaybar put on a car where the driver has no clue what to do when the rear begins to slide....especially in a car that sees winter/icy conditions.
My 2 cents.
So should I be concerned about any possible negative effects of upgrading the rear anti-sway on the TSX that will be used for daily driving (and year round in potential snow) by the wife and I?
Cause just to make sure I understand on the sway bar issue, and specifically speaking about the TSX (and an automatic at that):
In snowy conditions and/or in certain situations the Comptech Anti Sway vs. the stock sway, will it be fine or will it increase the chance of back end swinging out in my specific situation.

One of you guys said it, and I think I'm gonna switch the plan & make 1 change at a time to make sure it is the right one. Then move on to the next.

Just so hard not to jump in on some things - get so pumped up. But maybe better slow & steady... (at least as far as upgrades and being a noob like myself...)

In any event, thanks again...
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
1,514 Posts
I don't want to be the one to tell you that the likelihood of swapping ends after the rear sway is nonexistent, because with my luck you'll put it on and wrap your car around a tree :eek: ........

However, with this car, I have not PERSONALLY found that particular trait. I have seen it with other cars, but not this one. Sure, there is less understeer, but even lift throttle doesn't unsettle it. Its a combination of the major weight imbalance toward the front, the heavy dose of negative camber in the rear, and the stability control.

That's not to say you couldn't loop it, but I can't imagine happening under normal circumstances - you'd have to be really pushing it.
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
1,514 Posts
Oh, and on the subject of tires in the Northeast-

Any summer compound tire will perform poorly when the temps are cold-you really shouldn't run them at all past October. Often, the tread pattern would be okay for shedding snow, and some do very well in the rain, but they can be a bear on a cold dry day......

Toyo Proxies 4 makes a nice all season choice if you don't want to swap out to snows......
 

·
, Moderator Emeritus
Joined
·
7,952 Posts
:agree: I have Proxie 4's Right now, great tires, however I am debating on just going strait up summer tires/ strait up winters
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
167 Posts
Just to re-interate, you will be fine with a rear swaybar on the TSX, even in snow. Drive the car and play with it in a parking lot to get use to the new balance.

Doing things in steps is the best way to go, of the seven Hondas/Acuras I have owned/raced the most significant performance enhancer was the driver :nervous: second were the tires, third balance (suspension, swaybars, shocks, springs, etc), fourth brakes, fifth engine.

Chad...who has passed e46 drivers in his stock 89 Integra on a racetrack in the rain :laugh:
 

·
Sleeperus-Maximus
Joined
·
164 Posts
TodaSi said:
Just to re-interate, you will be fine with a rear swaybar on the TSX, even in snow. Drive the car and play with it in a parking lot to get use to the new balance.

Doing things in steps is the best way to go, of the seven Hondas/Acuras I have owned/raced the most significant performance enhancer was the driver :nervous: second were the tires, third balance (suspension, swaybars, shocks, springs, etc), fourth brakes, fifth engine.

Chad...who has passed e46 drivers in his stock 89 Integra on a racetrack in the rain :laugh:

Snap ovesteer only happens at the limits. I’m not surprised that people with the bar haven’t found over steer to be a problem. That’s because you aren’t driving at or near the limit of the suspension's and tire's ability. Do this, however; while lifting throttle at mid apex and I promise you some over steer action.


Save the money that you were going to spend on the intake and suspension, and invest in a good set of summer tires/rims and winter tires and rims.

The Toyo T1-S or Falken Azenis (the race compound/tread tire, the other Azenis sucks ass) on some lightweight rims will do you good. Volk Racing makes some super 'leet ultra light rims if you have the money. Or (if you want to get cheap) some Helium, Lenso, or Rota rims will fit the bill. All are super light and moderately to cheaply priced.

For winter tires, some cheap Rotas or something combined with those Blizzak snow tires will get you through even the worst snow/ice conditions. These things are like rubber AWD for your FWD coupe.

Swap between the two when the weather demands it. Both sets of tires will last 2-3x as long because you arent running them 24/7/365 so you will get even more then your money's worth.


Remember, be it on dry or wet or snow and ice, the tires are suposedly the only part of your car that is to touch the ground. That means this is THE MOST important piece of qequipment on or in your car besides the driver.

When you have more money later on, look into the coilovers/sway bar combo and then the intake/header/exhaust route. Also, what those mods I would look into the Hondata reflash. The K series engines see serious gains with the intake/header/exhaust combo when combined with the Hondata reprogramming. A good driver could get into the low 14s with all of that.
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Top