[MikeySpec]

Mikeyspec, did you dyno the short ram air filter with the hood open or closed?

I dyno'ed it with the hood open. To check variations i ended up testing this three ways.

#1. Comptech Box was run with fans on
#2. Open Filter was run with fans off
#3. Open Filter with fans on


Runs 2 and 3 did not make much of a difference, it was +/- .5whp even with the car running for a while. Keep in mind the dyno room was about 55 degrees but from my experience you dont suffer from major heat soak issues until its really really hot. Otherwise in my opinion its best to have the intake where the powerband is happiest. Air from outside sources can always be fed there one way or another.

Hey Mike, good job! Are you still using the snorkel? It helps to direct cool air right into the filter!

Yes I am

Interesting...I did not notice the same thing in our test. Also, I did not have a header or a re-flash so that could make a difference.

Your testing was the first thing i thought of but at the same time with a stock ecu you will only benefit so much from modifications. I'm sure you are aware of extra wanted/needed/tuned for air volume associated when tuning VTC maps. Its almost as though these cars are tuned straight for whatever manifolds and intake they are given from the factory and anything more than whats provided doesnt show much gains until its really tuned for it.

 

[MikeySpec]

Just so i'm a little more clear on the cai/airbox/short ram theory i have.....

Your engine wants your intake to be a certain size and length the same way an engine wants an intake manifold to be a certain shape with certain sized runners and etc. When your throttle body opens wide, your engine no longer knows much of the difference between intake and plenum. In a sense your intake is now partially considered into your "pleunum volume".

So...in short. When you dyno these different intakes and see different gains. The CAI vs. Short ram gains are not because its grabbing colder denser air from the wheel well, its because the intake length and diameter are more better suited for the application. As far as the "ram air" effect...this is something not usually seen until very high speeds usually above 80 or so. So with that said i've found an intake that my car likes on the dyno. I know it will be "heat soaking" with the hood shut but with a little air hose feeding it.....that problem will be solved. The car feels great with the new mods and it looks like i'll be making a trip to the drag strip in Indiana this Sunday.

 

[dinoc]

Yes by protecting your SRI from heat you will get a system similar with the Gruppe-M.
I know someone from here (can't remember who) built himself a GM like intake . He built a box like around that cone filter. I'm thinking a tube like the one from Comptech could feed cold air to that box.
Maybe you can inspire more from GM intake

 

[CalgaryTSX]

I dyno'ed it with the hood open...

... Keep in mind the dyno room was about 55 degrees but from my experience you dont suffer from major heat soak issues until its really really hot. Otherwise in my opinion its best to have the intake where the powerband is happiest. Air from outside sources can always be fed there one way or another.

SRI, hood open, ambient air temp of 55F....

While 11RWHP is significant, I would put forward the majority of that came from the cool ambient temp and hood open.
I've seen many older 5.0L Mustangs have even greater gains from doing the same on a chassis dyno.

The TSX engine bay is very sealed & everything gets hot and heat soaked in it. Especially a SRI in behind the battery.
So a SRI will really suffer when the hood is closed. But very little, if any, effect to a CAI or CompTech style air intake.

I just don't want everyone to run out and install a SRI expecting to get 11RWHP..

 

[tsxtasy]

I took the horn off my icebox and I swear the butt dyno shows a difference. I can hear a difference too. It's a little louder. After having the horn off for a while, I wouldn't go back to having it on.

 

[H22_J30_K24]

Can't wait for your track times Mikey! And if its not too much trouble please let us know what the outside temps are like that day vs your impressive runs the other day. Thanks!


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[Nino]

I wouldn't jump too fast on whole "heat soak" thing either. I have seen datalogs for under hood temps and cai filter location temps. In slow stop and go, cai filter location was indeed cooler, but up to speed the temp was actually identical. If one ducts some cold air to filter location, this will be non issue in anything but stop and go traffic. If you use stock intake arm plus v stack from the same material as stock nylon/plastic airbox you should be set.

Real concern here is hitting sweet spot in intake size and length, and if stock arm with 3.5" v stack "stuck" on it is or is close to "sweet spot" there will be no holding this back.

In short, if this combo is close to stock k24 ideal intake length and diameter, there will be no cai or cold anything that will touch this for power. Either way track times/mph will tell.

Talking about old Mustangs, I have also seen Mustang guy put v stack straight on TB and gain 2 tenths down the quarter, after that he spent whole day making changes and not being able to get those 2 tenths back in any other configuration.

Nino

 

[CalgaryTSX]

I wouldn't jump too fast on whole "heat soak" thing either. I have seen datalogs for under hood temps and cai filter location temps. In slow stop and go, cai filter location was indeed cooler, but up to speed the temp was actually identical. If one ducts some cold air to filter location, this will be non issue in anything but stop and go traffic. If you use stock intake arm plus v stack from the same material as stock nylon/plastic airbox you should be set.

Real concern here is hitting sweet spot in intake size and length, and if stock arm with 3.5" v stack "stuck" on it is or is close to "sweet spot" there will be no holding this back.

In short, if this combo is close to stock k24 ideal intake length and diameter, there will be no cai or cold anything that will touch this for power. Either way track times/mph will tell.

Talking about old Mustangs, I have also seen Mustang guy put v stack straight on TB and gain 2 tenths down the quarter, after that he spent whole day making changes and not being able to get those 2 tenths back in any other configuration.

Nino

JTso's finding on Acura-Zine was the complete opposite. He was datalogging TSX underhood & IAT temps comparing a SRI & a CAI.
The differences were dramatic. http://acura***zine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=794885

If you study the TSX engine bay it's nearly completely sealed. Front, top, bottom, rear. The only air entering the engine bay is going thru the radiator.
Touch anything in the TSX engine after a drive even on a cool day. Everything is hot. There is no cool air flowing in there.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, the 1/4 MPH trap speed is the HP indicator, not the ET.
When Mikeyspec runs his SRI, the MPH change will be the best indicator, assuming similar environmental conditions, no other mods to the car.

 

[Nino]

JTso's finding on Acura-Zine was the complete opposite. He was datalogging TSX underhood & IAT temps comparing a SRI & a CAI.
The differences were dramatic. http://acura***zine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=794885

If you study the TSX engine bay it's nearly completely sealed. Front, top, bottom, rear. The only air entering the engine bay is going thru the radiator.
Touch anything in the TSX engine after a drive even on a cool day. Everything is hot. There is no cool air flowing in there.

As mentioned earlier in this thread, the 1/4 MPH trap speed is the HP indicator, not the ET.
When Mikeyspec runs his SRI, the MPH change will be the best indicator, assuming similar environmental conditions, no other mods to the car.

I hear your point, so this will be the best possible test. If indeed TSX has such heat soaked engine bay and sealed hood, track numbers will provide the answers. What matters more, cooler air charge (provided nothing is done to cool it down for v stack setup) or optimized intake dimensions? Hopefully track date works out...


Nino

 

[MikeySpec]

Well here's the deal. I've installed the plm header and went back on the dyno.......there was 7whp peak and 5tq with about 10-11 whp at 7,000 rpm. The car feels phenomenal. Other than that im trying to see if I can do a drag radial pass or two before putting the 23x8x15 slicks on. I almost feel as though my car won't be happy on a slick seeing that I can only launch from 4400 or lower. I was launching at 4200 on the radials with minimal spin. The track is open Sunday and temps look like they'll be in the mid to low 50's. My prediction is about 98-99 mph out of the car which will equate to hopefully a 13.80 on a radial. If the slicks work, perhaps a 13.60.

 

[Nino]

Well here's the deal. I've installed the plm header and went back on the dyno.......there was 7whp peak and 5tq with about 10-11 whp at 7,000 rpm. The car feels phenomenal. Other than that im trying to see if I can do a drag radial pass or two before putting the 23x8x15 slicks on. I almost feel as though my car won't be happy on a slick seeing that I can only launch from 4400 or lower. I was launching at 4200 on the radials with minimal spin. The track is open Sunday and temps look like they'll be in the mid to low 50's. My prediction is about 98-99 mph out of the car which will equate to hopefully a 13.80 on a radial. If the slicks work, perhaps a 13.60.

Is there a chance you can bring CT box/stock bottom with you and do a quick swap to CT ice box for one pass, just to put this to test?

Since you have installed PLM that will definitely up your mph, so once you dial this in, one pass with CT setup should be all it takes to give us some ammo for next 500 posts on CAI vs vstack stock arm

 

[H22_J30_K24]

Niño that's a great idea - removes the header as a variable. Too bad we'd have to pay him for labor for his trouble!


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[Nino]

Niño that's a great idea - removes the header as a variable. Too bad we'd have to pay him for labor for his trouble!


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Pay him? Last time I tried he wouldn't hear about it...

According to earlier post, cold feed for CT box is still on the car, this can be swapped out in 5 minutes right at the track. Anyway, if possible, it would be great as dyno can be argued all day, but not so with mph...

 

[MikeySpec]

I'm willing to bring the icebox with me. It takes about 2 minutes for me to swap out the intakes. I'll just have to be sure that my runs are consistent before doing anything. I will be running on radials first and if i grow some balls i'm strapping on the slicks. Shooting for about 100 mph traps but i know ill come up short. Anything in the 13's and im happy...for a basic bolt ons tank.

 

[Nino]

I'm willing to bring the icebox with me. It takes about 2 minutes for me to swap out the intakes. I'll just have to be sure that my runs are consistent before doing anything. I will be running on radials first and if i grow some balls i'm strapping on the slicks. Shooting for about 100 mph traps but i know ill come up short. Anything in the 13's and im happy...for a basic bolt ons tank.

Thank you, much appreciated.

Good luck at the track!

 

[98luder]

very nice work, thank you for sharing your findings.

 

[H22_J30_K24]

Did I miss an update? We're you able to get to the track last weekend? Thanks again for the info!

 

[MikeySpec]

Sucks, i wasnt able to make it to the track on Sunday and I wont see an other opportunity until April. By April the engine should be changed up a good amount. Maybe i'll just make my goal to skip the 13's all together and shoot for 12's on motor! LOL i wish

 

[Nino]

Sucks, i wasnt able to make it to the track on Sunday and I wont see an other opportunity until April. By April the engine should be changed up a good amount. Maybe i'll just make my goal to skip the 13's all together and shoot for 12's on motor! LOL i wish

There is always the next time. I just wonder how far from DD is this car going to get by April. What are the plans?

 

[MikeySpec]

There is always the next time. I just wonder how far from DD is this car going to get by April. What are the plans?

It'll be kept as basic as i can make it seeing as i still have to get my CRX back in action. Plans are.....

IPS K2 Cams with OEM S2K/RSX-S valvetrain combo
50* vtc
K20a2 Oil Pump
09+TSX Pistons
06 TSX Head with 4Piston or PortFlow Valvetrain
RBC with J35 TB
RDX inj, Flashpro

Hoping for anything around 230+whp and i'll be happy. Im sure it'll eclipse that by a fair margin. Im more concerned on the response and midrange for track use.