[JamesFrank]

Hello all,

I'd like to welcome myself to this Forum. I own a 2005 TSX 6 Speed that I'm currently in the process of restoring believe it or not. I've always loved this car so here I am fixing er' up while I drive my 2010 Civic LX around.

Currently cars in pieces. Transmission is out.

I downed this car originally cause of an oddly aggressive ticking/ bearing noise that starts after 30 mph/ 50 - 60 kmh. I went through all the steps of inspection: Wheel bearing, Half shaft support bearing, Pilot, Throw out, Input shaft bearing, play in axles, torques on axle nuts, etc. Just before the noise started, 6 months prior I put a Clutch assembly in (210K on original Clutch assembly), and 3 months prior I snapped a half shaft trying to climb my driveway in the winter (bought aftermarket shaft, no noise for 3 months at all, no issues). Moving forward - I ended up grabbing the stethoscope out and isolating it to the Transmission while I had my buddy driving it on stands after 50 kmh. I'm going to add a few pictures as I'm feeling like a rookie with this problem cause I've never seen this before in anything I've worked on and I guess limiting yourself to getting rebuilt transmissions for customers instead of splitting cases and rebuilding it yourself limits your experience - I GET IT.

After all my diagnosing, before I put it on stands, my thought was Carrier Bearing failure or chipped tooth in Final Drive. After pulling it apart, Carrier Bearings appear fine. No chips in teeth except slight pitting on the gear of the spider in Differential. But this caught my eye. Pitting at the base of the counter shaft itself and wear in the oil retainer gasket thingy (clearly I got no correct name to describe this) at the base of the shaft under the case bearing.

Any insight would be amazing. I'm just trying to get this car back on the road so I can have something to enjoy cause its been too many years since I had a car/toy to play with.

Under the counter shaft bearing(bearing at the top), there is wearing like the counter shaft is grooving into the base. Under the oil gasket retainer thing below the bearing, there grooves in the case.

Look at the pitting in the base of the shaft. Would this be what causing the noise? Looking like the roller bearing a locking and the shaft keeps spinning.

Apparently there's a post about CSB walking up and creating a pitch that causes a TON of problems. But it's so uncommon. I'm second owner and really didn't beat this thing.
All gears on main and CS are fine. Syncros, no wear on case or egg shapes bearing housing..
One of the motor mounts were worn, maybe causing a pitch in drive light and pitch carrier bearings.
I thought for the longest time the aftermarket half shaft might be too long or incorrect. There's no c-ring at the transmission side which I found unique (wish I had money for a honda drive shaft but who wants to drop money like what Honda wants)

 

[shandalo]

First off, welcome to the forum! It's very refreshing to see someone "new" come in with a real problem that isn't already documented, detailed descriptions and pictures! Glad to have another real DIYer around.

I don't see anything in the top picture that looks alarming. That oiling plate, or whatever it is called, is a contact surface with the countershaft so there would be some wear expected after significant mileage.

The wear on your countershaft itself does look problematic and could likely be the problem. If you put the countershaft in its bearing location and turn it.... I presume it probably doesn't roll smoothly? Any visible damage to the countershaft bearing? Sometimes bearing damage can be elusive. I rebuilt a Civic trans years ago that had a bearing whine. I just replaced all bearings, seals and synchros. Synchros were worn out anyway. Never did see the cause of the bearing whine until several years later. The old bearings just hung around for a while and one day I picked one up, rolled it around, and spotted this:

(It just took me about 15min to find those spots in the bearing again to take a pic)

If I had to guess, I'd say even if the countershaft bearing seems to be ok, at some point there was debris that at least froze it up for a moment and damaged the countershaft. Or the diff bearings are worn out and this allowed play in the ring gear which transferred into the countershaft. How much metal is on the magnet in the case? Anything big? Any particles in the oil you drained?

By "carrier bearings" I presume you are talking about the diff bearings and not just the one on the half shaft?

Since you're already this far, is recommend just replacing every bearing, seal and synchro before you put it back together. Also, obviously replace any damaged parts like that countershaft, gear hubs, etc.

Our half shafts do not need retainer rings to stay in the transmission since they are fixed to the block. There is no way for the half shaft to just slip out like a CV axle would.

Also, I can't imagine snapping a half shaft.... It's a solid steel bar with a carrier bearing. Seems like something else would give first... But anyway...

Where are you located? I have my old TSX trans internals sitting in a box in my garage waiting for their day. Seems like they might be of use to you. I probably have an extra OEM halfshaft available as well. Shoot me a PM if you need parts.

 

[JamesFrank]

Thanks for the reply, Shadalo. I'm north of the Greater Toronto Area,

The bearing you've posted is what I'll call the upper bearing for the Counter Shaft. On mine it's fine - if anything, flawless - no issues. The lower bearing seems fine as-well. What's bugging me is if the bearing was pinching cause of the burrs on the shaft, then there would be some sort of wear on the bearings themselves. Bearings are fine. Nothing like what you've posted.

I sat the shaft in it's bearing and had a buddy hold the top bearing while I put a 12V impact gun on it to spin the shaft to some speed on it to see if I can mimic the noise. The only noise I hear is the base of the shaft grinding to the oil swash plate under the lower bearing. Shaft is tight in the bearing. No play at all.

At this point, I'm going to swap in the input shaft bearing, replace the countershaft bearing and oil plate and attempt to emery cloth the burrs on the shaft down. Might have to order a bearing that can compensate for the inner diameter difference on the countershaft is I take it down too much.

And yes, by Carrier bearing I'm referring to the Differential bearings.

This is what you get for trying to be preventative and downing the car before it grenades. Should've kept driving it and when it shatters, I know what to fix hahahah

 

[shandalo]

I agree it does not make sense for the countershaft to be marred while the bearing is not. Did you do your test with the shaft horizontal like it would be in the car? Doing it vertically would put no real load on the bearing like it would have while it is in the car.

Finding a bearing to take up just a few more thousandths of an inch might be quite a task. I dug up my old parts last night and I have a clean countershaft available. Along with anything else you might need. International shipping might put a damper on this thou...

Either way, good luck!