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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
2005 TSX Stock 6 speed manual

Things on my list already are:
Flash Pro with upgraded ecu from a 2008 tsx I picked this as my first thing for 2 reasons I was able to acquire the ecu very cheep and i wanted to future proof myself for more upgrades to come.
I hate more than anything buying the bare minimum and then upgrading that same part again if that makes any sense? lol
I am going to be getting the RRC Intake eventually as well and wanted to mate that to the J37 TB? Any advice on my plans so far? also I need advice on other items I will need to achieve my goal of at least 300bhp and a order they should be installed in to keep my car on the road with no downtime. So any and all advice is useful and let me know if I am on the right track so far. Thanks again
 

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k20a.org

Also, you're not getting anywhere near 300bhp with no downtime unless you're supercharging or running nitrous. Stock compression isn't going to allow it first off, nor is any drop in cam so be prepared to remove the head for supporting valvetrain upgrades. KANO is around 250-260bhp via a DynoMite dyno, and that's honestly probably reading a tad high going by independent dyno comparisons. Regardless though, you're honestly asking too much out of an uncracked all motor K24A2, and no down time.

A quick recommendation I'd suggest would be an RBC instead of the RRC. Its been argued over to death, but do you own research at k20a and decide for yourself if the low end torque loss you'd want for DD is worth the relatively small top end HP difference from the RRC.

Best of luck man :)
 

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If he's going that high a vtc swap w the RRC will not net a tq loss. If your chasing numbers your going to have to go boost of some sort, either turbo or sc.


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If he's going that high a vtc swap w the RRC will not net a tq loss. If your chasing numbers your going to have to go boost of some sort, either turbo or sc.


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Unfortunately everything here is incorrect.

VTC will help mitigate some of the loss, but will not negate all of it. Low end torque relies heavily on intake velocity, which is directly linked to runner length and cross sectional width; Bardi (user Awok) and PreciseStyles can further educate you on this principle here, or head over to K20a.org as I mentioned before.. Again OP, do your own research into the RBC vs RRC, don't take any one person's opinion including mine.

As for requiring forced induction, 275+whp all motor K's are pretty commonplace in the built all motor scene right now. We have a K24A2 with both A/C and P/S in my brother's 97 DB8 GSR putting 278 down on a dynojet. No forced induction and very streetable. All common K parts; RBC, Hybrid TB, 12.4 static CR, ID1000's, ASP header, 45 VTC, Drag Cartel cams, 3" mandrel full through. We don't have access to 91 octane here, only 87, 89,and 93 so that netted some power with the allowance of better timing compared to those without access to 93. Either way this is a standard mid-level all motor build with over 300bhp.

Did I mention K20a.org? :laugh:
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Well it seams I expected a bit much with the hp lol but I would like at least 300 hp or close I am not apposed to the sc idea eventually either if that's what it takes but besides that what are the realistic gains I would and can accomplish with flash pro rcc or rbc intake and j37 and a good air intake and cam what can is recommended? What air intake is recommended? What exhaust is recommended? What other things that can be installed with no downtime are recommended?
 

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Unfortunately everything here is incorrect.

VTC will help mitigate some of the loss, but will not negate all of it. Low end torque relies heavily on intake velocity, which is directly linked to runner length and cross sectional width; Bardi (user Awok) and PreciseStyles can further educate you on this principle here, or head over to K20a.org as I mentioned before.. Again OP, do your own research into the RBC vs RRC, don't take any one person's opinion including mine.

As for requiring forced induction, 275+whp all motor K's are pretty commonplace in the built all motor scene right now. We have a K24A2 with both A/C and P/S in my brother's 97 DB8 GSR putting 278 down on a dynojet. No forced induction and very streetable. All common K parts; RBC, Hybrid TB, 12.4 static CR, ID1000's, ASP header, 45 VTC, Drag Cartel cams, 3" mandrel full through. We don't have access to 91 octane here, only 87, 89,and 93 so that netted some power with the allowance of better timing compared to those without access to 93. Either way this is a standard mid-level all motor build with over 300bhp.

Did I mention K20a.org? :laugh:
yea your right

Pause

Not.

http://www.superstreetonline.com/te..._series_intake_manifold_shootout/viewall.html

There is also great info in the article that Honda Tuning did on the TSX project they have been working on. Although I'm not sure they have posted the entire write up online. I know the first part is, not sure on the rest.

Either way with a stock bottom end there has yet to be any info that I have come across that shows a k24 reaching 300whp NA with a stock bottom end.

But as stated above, if hp is your goal, click on over to k20a.org. Everything that you want to do more than likely has been done and shown over there. It is the best site for engine mods on the k series.





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yea your right

Pause

Not.
I forgot more and more kids are being given our cars these days...the maturity level just continues to drop in accordance, it seems. Really reminds me why I spend the majority of my forum time on the supra forums :shootme:

As for your article, a standard tuned RBC with a tapered 64mm TB vs a fully tuned RRC with a straight through 70mm on a K20 really seems like a legit side by side comparison....especially in regards to a K24...:laugh:


Unless you're doing a full cam/valve train changeover with all the supporting mods, the RRC is a waste of money on a K24. It's been beaten to death. He wants no downtime ie, no high lift cams/valves/pistons etc, so how is the RRC going to benefit him on an uncracked K24A2 instead of a portmatched RBC? It won't, and the gains just aren't going to be noticeable at all.

Read again: "No Downtime". RRC with standard bolt-ons on the K24A2 yields no noticeable gains. If you want that extra couple peak horsepower for dynograph purposes only by all means get an RRC, and enjoy the low end torque loss.

Either way with a stock bottom end there has yet to be any info that I have come across that shows a k24 reaching 300whp NA with a stock bottom end.
Who's asking for 300whp NA on a stock bottom end? He's already revised his goals and expectations.

Ill defer all future advice to jvillefinest as he can give you super street articles with dynotesting showing manifolds using largely varying TB port matching/ TB sizes on a much smaller K engine :festive:

I only go by actual research and experience building 280whp K's when it comes to these matters....:laugh:

Best of luck TSX714! PM PrecyseStyles, he has a pretty wicked all motor TSX and may be able to give you more insight :thumbsup:


Edit: here you go TSX714, a link to PrecyseStyle's thread, later increased to 275/207 :thumbsup:

http://www.tsxclub.com/forums/1st-g...no-boost-no-nitrous-all-motor-w-dyno-vid.html

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I forgot more and more kids are being given our cars these days...the maturity level just continues to drop in accordance, it seems. Really reminds me why I spend the majority of my forum time on the supra forums :shootme:

As for your article, a standard tuned RBC with a tapered 64mm TB vs a fully tuned RRC with a straight through 70mm on a K20 really seems like a legit side by side comparison....especially in regards to a K24...:laugh:


Unless you're doing a full cam/valve train changeover with all the supporting mods, the RRC is a waste of money on a K24. It's been beaten to death. He wants no downtime ie, no high lift cams/valves/pistons etc, so how is the RRC going to benefit him on an uncracked K24A2 instead of a portmatched RBC? It won't, and the gains just aren't going to be noticeable at all.

Read again: "No Downtime". RRC with standard bolt-ons on the K24A2 yields no noticeable gains. If you want that extra couple peak horsepower for dynograph purposes only by all means get an RRC, and enjoy the low end torque loss.



Who's asking for 300whp NA on a stock bottom end? He's already revised his goals and expectations.

Ill defer all future advice to jvillefinest as he can give you super street articles with dynotesting showing manifolds using largely varying TB port matching/ TB sizes on a much smaller K engine :festive:

I only go by actual research and experience building 280whp K's when it comes to these matters....:laugh:

Best of luck TSX714! PM PrecyseStyles, he has a pretty wicked all motor TSX and may be able to give you more insight :thumbsup:


Edit: here you go TSX714, a link to PrecyseStyle's thread, later increased to 275/207 :thumbsup:

http://www.tsxclub.com/forums/1st-g...no-boost-no-nitrous-all-motor-w-dyno-vid.html

Sent using Autoguide from my iPad.
Thank you very much Adam and everyone who tried to help with this. I must confess I am simply use to more power going from a e46 M3 to a TSX makes me want to shoot myself lol. BUT the tsx will never be a M3 and I am not expecting it to I just want more power than what it already has I mean if we all look at the trends for the past 10 years of HP on most car manufactures keep cranking up the hp each year pretty soon the freaking Toyota Camery will be stock 400hp just because lol. So I will stop ranting on this and get to the point and goal I want to be able to have the power if needed to pass common cars for now Over all I want to keep my "honda" as my "reliable" every day driver but want more power yet keep it reliable, Example this car is not going to be tracked or raced well maybe a little raced if some asshole on the freeway pisses me off but other than that I will not go as far as to sacrifice the reliability for EXTREME Power that is not my goal! and as i stated i have no prob with having flash pro as my first upgrade because at least to me that sets me up for the future and fine tuning. And as for my original goal of up to 350 I clearly was dreaming and thinking of my M3 LOL I know that goal is doable but i am not gonna blow 10k+ on my honda to "try" to get to that goal and create a unstable car. My new goal is 250-300 would be fine with me because I gotta say as much as I love my car stock this thing sucks. So Once again Thank you Adam and all of you for your ideas and "Positive" feedback I really appreciated it. I will be checking out that link Adam I saw the description and thought right away you got and understood my goals so I will be checking that out right now. Thanks again everyone!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Took a look at the link and sent a pm I gotta say that is very very close what what I had a idea to do! Thank you again for the assistance! I will be in contact with PrecyseStyle!
 

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I forgot more and more kids are being given our cars these days...the maturity level just continues to drop in accordance, it seems. Really reminds me why I spend the majority of my forum time on the supra forums :shootme:.
Now most of the time when someone disagrees with me, I leave it as that and hope that the person does further research and comes up with their own thoughts, but since I spend alot of time surfing around here and actually like this site and value my rep, I have to reply.

First off, no kid here, damn near 27 at this point. I purchased my car almost 3 years ago now and have been a common posting member since. Not really sure how someone with no REP, 1/3 of the posts and no iTrader can talk down to a common member but its the world we live in.


As for your article, a standard tuned RBC with a tapered 64mm TB vs a fully tuned RRC with a straight through 70mm on a K20 really seems like a legit side by side comparison....especially in regards to a K24...:laugh:


Unless you're doing a full cam/valve train changeover with all the supporting mods, the RRC is a waste of money on a K24. It's been beaten to death. He wants no downtime ie, no high lift cams/valves/pistons etc, so how is the RRC going to benefit him on an uncracked K24A2 instead of a portmatched RBC? It won't, and the gains just aren't going to be noticeable at all.
Most of this im going to have to agree with. The statement I was trying to reverse was the idea that the RRC gives up tq for high end HP. Which is not true. A tuned RBC has been shown to lose some midrange, that is then gained back with a VTC and some tuning, the RRC doesnt have this. While I agree that you have to spin the motor to really see the RRC shine, and other supporting mods are needed to get its full potential.



Who's asking for 300whp NA on a stock bottom end? He's already revised his goals and expectations.
The OP was. The edit feature is nice, but in instances like this, it angers me. If you change your question, post it in a reply. Changing the opening question only screws up the forum for someone searching after the thread has died.
 

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Now most of the time when someone disagrees with me, I leave it as that and hope that the person does further research and comes up with their own thoughts, but since I spend alot of time surfing around here and actually like this site and value my rep, I have to reply.

First off, no kid here, damn near 27 at this point. I purchased my car almost 3 years ago now and have been a common posting member since. Not really sure how someone with no REP, 1/3 of the posts and no iTrader can talk down to a common member but its the world we live in.
:laugh: " yeah you're right. Pause. Not."

Impressive method of "Leaving it as it is when someone disagrees"with you :lol::lol::lol: I particularly enjoyed the way you resorted to a middle school phrase :thumbsup:

As for your rep/post count/I trader comment.....REALLY? Lol...forum egotism spawned from that is funny.

Leave the technical engine discussions to those who actually BUILD and understand the mechanics of what's being discussed. Low post counts or not, how many 740whp MKIV's have you personally built and currently own; or 280whp K's have you built in your family?

Doesn't matter the platform, engine mechanics are engine mechanics are engine mechanics. The lesson here for you is don't spread your half-truth missinformation based on heresay, partial knowledge, and half-read SuperStreet articles, followed by immature comments in retaliation to followup posts informing others you're not correct.

Carry on with your Rep, I trader, and post counting. I'll continue with actual contributions on technical matters

The OP got the information and direction he needed to further pursue his goal, so this thread is done. Continue if you'd like jvill, but I don't really feel this is going anywhere. As such, farewell
 
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