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Help me decide: RRC or RBB

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29K views 50 replies 14 participants last post by  LeeMaster  
#1 ·
My 04 currently have:
CT-E I/H, 06 cat, reflash

I plan to add:
06 cam, 45 VTC, J35 TB, FlashPro, 06 IM or RRC

I have reasearched but cannot decide whether to go with RRC or 06 RBB. My preference is to not lose too much low-mid torque. RRC on K20 seems to get good top-end power and mid-range torque. But on K24, I find some say the same still hold true while others report loss of torque compared with RBB. Another thing is many people who run RRC also have RDX injectors, so I wonder whether RDX injector is needed to get the top-end gain and/or maintain the mid-range torque. My own guessing is, if CT-E SC kit can +50 hp with stock injector, that means RDX one is not absolutely necessary for RRC.

Anyway, advice needed and appreciated. TIA!
 
#2 ·
RRC, the 45* VTC almost makes up for it, and you wont notice much of a difference.

RDX injectors arent "needed" but are recommended as you will start to get close to maxing the injectors out. In general its usually best to keep them below 80% duty cycle, with your plans you will probably see above that during WOT.
 
#3 ·
RRC, the 45* VTC almost makes up for it, and you wont notice much of a difference.



RDX injectors arent "needed" but are recommended as you will start to get close to maxing the injectors out. In general its usually best to keep them below 80% duty cycle, with your plans you will probably see above that during WOT.

2nded. The RRC w the vtc will yield more gains throughout the rpm band not to mention more tunability for growing later.





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#5 ·
Thanks all. I will shoot for RRC then. As for installation, I know people have been using T fitting to connect the engine mount hose and PCV hose. If I don't want to add oil catch can, how to prevent PCV gas from entering engine mount tube?
 
#6 ·
Bummer, looks like RRC is hard to find new with a reasonable price. Honda dealership no longer carry it. Anyone know I can get one new for around 500?
 
#9 ·
Yup. Big bummer. It was Hondas call to no longer ship the RRC over seas. They always keep the good shit to themselves.


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#12 ·
We are the minority because we changed the vtc and tuned accordingly.


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#13 ·
VTC has nothing to do with torque loss, its all about manifold runners geometry and shape. Narrow runners makes better air velocity and better low rpms torque because of this, but they are too narrow to let more air in at higher revs. VTC just let you use optimal combination of resonance and overlap to fill cylinders better.
Dont forget that stock CL9 is family sedan for moving ass from point a to point b , all been designed for that purpose.
 
#14 ·
Correct.

What I meant was, we don't notice a loss of low end tq after changing to RBC because of the vtc change and tuning that brings the loss back.


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#34 · (Edited)
Sorry if I missed it but does anyone have any info or a link to the RSP intake manifold?



edit: Google only works if you spell correctly!


Image
 
#18 ·
most important revs for DD are 1500-3500. ufortunately rbc +vtc cant touch rbb there. he will tune his car anyway , with rbb or rbc , so the difference is still there. you cant have all and everywhere , rrc is just a good compromise ! but its hella pricey.... sony just need to choose what is more important , DD and fuel saving or revs and fun. or just buy rrc ))
 
#19 ·
Yeah I wish I started my modding when RRC was less than 400!
 
#20 ·
Yeah, dont port your rbb , its a dead horse , youll just screw it and waste your time and money. RSP is pricey also. So better look at k20 org classifields , i see they poping up there. NA guys go turbo and sell their NA stuff so you have a chance to get it there for 350-400. Post WTB thread also but watch for scammers ))
 
#21 ·
My comment wasn't about porting the RBB, but porting the RBC? ISn't that what the RRC is a nicely ported RBC?
 
#22 · (Edited)
Installing a short runner intake manifold designed for high rpm gains on a mild 2004 TSX with an auto transmission would be a mistake.
It will likely make the car a complete dog under 5000 rpm, slower than stock, only showing gains over 5000 rpm which is hard to maintain with a 5 speed auto trans versus a 6 speed manual trans.

Awoc cut apart and manually ported a 2006-08 TSX RBB intake manifold which showed minimal gains.


I have a spare upper and lower 2006-08 RBB intake manifold that I always thought would be a good candidate for Extrude Honing but the shipping is back and forth from Canada is expensive.
I am very familiar with extrude honing with my older 5.0L Mustang which also has a cast aluminum long runner intake manifold.
No loss in low end torque and excellent gains in higher RPM.

Although I'm sure no else has done it before, I feel that extrude honing the upper and lower TSX intake manifold would make for a good mild street combination.
No loss in low end torque but greater airflow and power mid and higher range.


If you are located in the U.S. perhaps you should look into extrude honing a 2006-08 intake manifold?


As several have mentioned, your automatic trans is a huge factor when modding your engine.

Very good discussion and thread :cheers:
 
#23 ·
RBB is good for stock Acura TSX if you plan to install FlashPro, exhaust header, VTC 50, TSX 06-08 intake camshaft (if your car older) then RBB doesn't shine. RRC, RBC or even RSP is better options.
Accord CL9 5AT Weapon-R header, TSX 06-08 intake cam, VTC50, RSP intake manifold, Flashpro with proper tune.
vs Ford Focus STI + chip
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q3klXGe9VtQ
 
#27 ·
After my tune, I gained HP and TQ....the car is faster then before. Nothing like a 6 speed, but still better then OEM.
 
#43 ·
FYI I talked to H-Motors Online and they said their RRC is sold out. A new batch will arrive two weeks later, and the price will be $499 instead of $449. Looks like RRC is in demand...
 
#45 ·
Just an update: I ended up getting RSP but after a few weeks I decided to go back to RBB. I absolutely love the sound of RSP and the way it pulls, unfortunately mine is AT and I misses the torque at part throttle at low rpm. It's my daily so RBB makes better sense at this stage.
 
#47 ·
#50 ·
^Your tuner is right regarding your header situation. The CT header does not move a lot of air it just wasn't designed for that. Small primary's, small collector outlet, and I wonder if the tubes are equal length.

Most of the bolton k24s I've seen do not benefit from 50 degree VTC wheel as many suggest to swap out for the stock one. I'm probably going to run one regardless for future mods.